Ideas for geoDefense 2
Thu, 09/03/2009 - 17:11
It may seem that geoDefense Swarm is the 'sequel' to geoDefense. In a way it is, but I consider both to be equal products that have a different take on the Tower Dedfense genre. GD will always be about fixed path or paths. And GDS will always be about open-field, build your own maze TD.
So, that means... there will be a geoDefense 2!
Here are some of the things I'm wanting to do so far:
- Multiple paths, with multiple entrances and exits. Essentially what GDS has but with paths.
- Special path segments: speed up, slow down, heal, etc. Similar to the special hexes in GDS.
- Creep Bosses
- Endless Mode (as exists in GDS)
What else would everyone like to see?
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I'd like to see the shock towers not be so effective. I think they were made 'stronger' when an update came in because Angular View was brutally hard, and suddenly it was a piece of cake if you just shock the heck out of 'em and keep 'em upstairs. I find myself trying to challenge myself by beating levels without shock towers or "only 1 shock tower" because they're too effective.
It'd be cool to have them either be weaker, or be limited in quantity. For that matter, it'd be cool to have any tower be limited in quantity: This level only allows 2 shock towers and 3 lasers, despite the fact that it's got tons of straightaways and fast stars." That'd be challenging.
Do not listen to this man. He's either an alien or a competitor. We need ALL the help we can get !!!!
the best thing GD2 could have is LOTS and LOTS of levels. in any way possible. that would the be the number one thing. everything else would be cool but many many levels would be my one and only suggestion.
love the game.
i made a user name just to make this comment.
One way to do that, of course, is for there to be a level editor and user-created levels. The problem is, it's very hard to make levels that are perfectly balanced. So most user levels won't be up to the same speed.... does that matter?
Dave - While you're completely right in your comment that it's very hard to make levels that are perfectly balanced (which is why GD is so great, since it's obvious you've put much time in balancing each level), I think if there's a way to share user levels, the 'cream of the crop' levels would rise to the top.
Most user levels won't be up to the same level quality as the 'out-of-the-box' levels, but some will and would offer even more enjoyment for everyone. I don't know how difficult it would be to provide share-able user-created levels (or if even Apple would approve), but I think you'd be surprised at the creaticity of your users.
Actually it's not all that difficult really. The hardest part is creating the UI for creating levels. Other games do this by providing a web UI for it. You get a code that is unique to your device and then you can edit the level on the web and test it on the device instantly as you work. Once you think it's worth sharing, you publish it and that makes it available to everyone else.
Requires creating a web service for editing levels and the UI for it. That's not extremely hard, but it is hard to do really well. Levels, right now, are expressed as XML. The level editor I use is a Mac application that only covers the path layout part. Then the rest is done with XML editing. And this works good because there is a lot of copy-n-paste efficiency in working in text files, you see. But it is also not "safe" enough for the end user... since it allows you to make mistakes that crash the parsing of those levels when they load.
I'd probably have to make some sort of ranking system so people could vote levels up or down perhaps? Some way of helping the cream rise to the top, so to speak. Ideas?
A ranking system would be great, you could use the AppStore as a model even
Lets face, the App Store version of rankings suck!
I'll do better. :)
-- David
ps. If you don't know why... I'll a'splain
Well, I guess I don't know much about it beyond the ability to give a rating and leave comments
Hrmm...well, a front-end that allows users to determine:
* number of waves
* number of creeps allowed to enter "home" to determine success/failure
* creep data per wave (ie, number of creeps per type of creep, creep speed, creep strength)
* lag time between waves
* types of towers that can be used
* upgrade $ required per tower type
I'm probably over-simplifying the parameters that can be controlled, but the front-end could post to a webservice, and then processing could happen server-side to create the properly formed XML. That way, you won't need to worry about bad XML that crashes during parsing. This probably wouldn't be too hard to do (I only say that because I'm a developer)...though creating a good intuitive front-end would be the real challenge. If truly ambitious, the front-end could be accessed via a typical PC-based browser, as well as mobile safari on the iPhone ;)
As for a UI that allows users to create their own paths via a web page...hrmm.., maybe an applet front-end that allows drag-n-drop drawing?
Just throwing some ideas out there ;)
The issue is not creating properly formed XML. The issue is that working in XML makes things much easier. To get a UI that lets you be as efficient will be difficult to construct. But maybe not a big deal to the die hards. Then again just pure XML might be fine for the die hards too! :)
Hey, don't hate me for that thought. All I'm saying is that Angular View used to kick my a**, and I almost never had the time or money to beat it, and then suddenly I could do this:
(If this image gets removed, it's a completed Angular View screen with only 3 lasers tied to 3 vortices (eh? you like that pluralization, don't you?), and 6 shock towers, with oodles of cash leftover. I didn't add or upgrade anything for the last 3-4 waves.)
My suggestion was to limit the shock effectiveness or put a counter on the tower purchases (e.g. the level only allows X of this type of tower, and Y of this tower, etc.)
I really hope this doesn't come off as whining or trashing GD because it's hands down my favorite game. I'm pretty sure my wife hates David, though.
been stuck on this level for days!!! followed your method but you must be in novice mode because it barely gets me to wave 29. i even add two more fully powered up slow towers inside the first triangle, no luck. have you beat this level on hardcore mode (i started in it and would like to beat the game in it). thanks!
Half the fun is finding really efficient ways to beat a level. That is a good one!
-- David
I like the split path idea, maybe some creeps are in a hurry to get to the end and take a 'shortcut'. Which ones will take the short path and which ones take the longer path? Trial and error time! LOL
EDIT: Ohhhh ohhh, and a leader board! =) I want to see if my 22Billion score on Med #2 stands up to any1
Don't worry, it will have online leaderboards. In fact, the 1.3 Update to GeoDefense will have them with OpenFeint. That update will be put into the review process once Swarm is out (cuz I need to link to it for the cross promot). Also has 4 new levels. :)
-- David
Is the AppStore ID different from the Apple ID in "Manage Your Applications"? I thought you could just insert that ID into an iTunes URL.
If that works then you could overlap the submission times of GD and GDS.
I think Cybinary's post inadvertently hits the nail on the head--it is extremely difficult to read highscores without commas seperating the 000s given how small the scores are displyed. Did you mean 22 million and not 22 billion as in 22,000,000,000? My high score for Gordy (level 2) is 51,690,090. Unless I'm missing something here or unless it's a typo, I don't see how a score like that is possible.
Anyway, my all time high score among all levels is 115,115,655 on "The Hat" (Medium level 3).
Edit* - Tried to copy and paste a pic of my high score leaderboard, but couldn't figure it out...
S37VEN, you are correct about the commas. My high score is 22Mil not bil, but it is hard to tell without the commas in the score.
More levels! Perhaps a level editor, with in-app uploading, downloading, comments and ratings :)
Multiplayer! Like that WC3 level where each player gets its own short path; anything you drop is forwarded to the next player (as well as taking a life). For the money, you can buy mobs to drop on your enemies (in addition to building towers).
Of course, these work as well in GD as in GDS...
All of your ideas are really cool too :) Boss mobs and multiple paths sound especially fun.
Well it's pretty obvious but I'd love to see an online hi-score table and probably some kind of cooperative mode would be fun.
I'd like to see either new towers or mutiple upgrade paths for the towers to allow for more creativity.
How about a mixture of Fixed and Free path? You could have a map with (as an example) fixed path at the top and an open field on the bottom.
How about bigger playing fields? Possilbe you could set up a zoom in/out function.
How about multi-level maps?
Michael
I was always a little frustrated when playing the tougher levels that when you lost nothing was registered. Being told 'that was your highest score' or 'that was the high creep stage you reached' for that level would have been nice. Rather than just 0 points.
Ok.... that's something I wrestled with too... keeping scores on incomplete or something. I'll think about that one. Maybe keep track of the highest wave you've cleared?
Random list of thoughts below:
Laer Tower Aiming - I always wanted the ability to aim a laser tower by touching it and dragging out with my finger to aim it and lock it. Waiting until it is pointing in about the right direction and then locking it is often hard.
EMP Shockwave Tower - knocks creeps backwards along the path. The distance knocked back is relative to the angle at which the shock comes compared with the angle of the path at that point. This makes placement of the EMP tower important. Could potentially knock out all towers within a given range for a period of time too. In that case, you might want to have this tower only activate when double-tapping it (like vortex).
Irradiate - Cause one creep to become radioactive and cause damage to any creeps near him or passing him on the path.
Teleport Tower - send all units in a given radius back to the start. Double-tap to activate.
Check out this page for other ideas:
http://www.creepcolony.com/spells.shtml
Laser Tower Aiming - I always wanted the ability to aim a laser tower by touching it and dragging out with my finger to aim it and lock it. Waiting until it is pointing in about the right direction and then locking it is often hard.
^I second this one, getting it just right can be a pain.
Teleport Tower - send all units in a given radius back to the start. Double-tap to activate.
^Sounds too much like a tower from The Creeps! TD game. Also kinda goes against the vibe GD has.
How about a tower that is like a shock tower and a regular turret. It would shoot a big glob that would slow down the enemy it hit and also would leave a stick residue on the path for all enemys that step on it to be slowed down also.
I noticed somebody mentioned how amazingly awesome a huge army of shock towers are. I don't think this is a problem since that strategy normally doesn't give you a very high score.
Also a local highscore table would be amazing, when i'm trying for a new highscore on a map and i don't get it, I'm frustaded that i can't find out how close i was.
I had the same thought on aiming a laser tower, but it conflicts with the UI for linking of a laser tower to a vortex tower.
I like the gloob tower thing. :)
Actually, it doesn't have to conflict. If you actually complete a connection to a vortex tower, then don't change the aim. If you don't connect to one, then change the firing angle.
Great game!!
I would like to see a level editor (maybe a tricky update?) where it is possible for players to create their own levels by simply drawing paths with their fingers, then selecting the number/type of creeps in each wave as well as the speed of creeps, price of towers etc from a menu after the path is drawn.
EDIT: one more thing; it would be awesome if these player created levels could then be uploaded to some sort of database so that other players may then download them. (And with OS 3.0 allowing micro-transactions a GD level market place might be possible? )
-jono
nsxDavid,
How about damage inflicted to turrets? (e.g. by nearby blasts/splash damage)
How about creeps that suck energy from vortex towers to heal themselves/other creeps?
"Blackout" creeps that temporarily shutdown nearby towers? (therefore need to be killed at a distance)
"Close combat creeps" that can only be killed at very short ranges? (immune to long range attacks)
Thanks for a great game, and waiting till Swarm is finally approved.
Cheers,
Tom
A bold idea: Keep it Simple Stupid! :)
A lot of the suggestions are well thought-out, and may actually enhance the game, but remember that the best games are the ones with the simplest ideas. I'd like you to devote a lot of time into perfecting the design, timing and difficulty of the levels.
That said, of course GD2 has to offer some new challenges! :)
EDIT: I'd like to see some documentation in numbers (yea, I know I'm a party-pooper) on how the game works. Exactly what differs between the tower upgrade levels, how much more damage the vortex boost gives, how the score is calculated, what the bonuses? (1x, 5x, 20x, 50x) are used for.
I agree with the KISS prinicpal.
As for numbers... they are difficult to even publish since the mechanisms are different for every level. Most everything is tweaked to give each a unique experience (while rewarding learned skills). It's tricky.
The bonuses are easy though... I have an FAQ on this site now too, btw. I think it's there, but if not, I'll add it. Anyway, every creep killed is worth 1 point times your current bonus multiplier which is shown in the top center of the screen. Your bonus goes up by 1 every time you kill a creep. But if you keep a creep near the exit you get even more bonus the closer you are. Hence the x2, x5, x20, etc.
So, to really blow the score up big you might rethink your tower strategy such that you try and get your kills near the exit. This is only practical near the beginning of levels... but sometimes not. In any case, once the online scoring is up this'll be a much bigger deal. :)
-- David
Most of what I'd like to see has already been suggested, so I'll just reiterate what ideas I'd like. :)
First and foremost - DLC of additional level packs! (I'd like this for GD1, too)
I'd also like some documentation about the numbers behind the scenes (creep HP, tower damage/range at each upgrade, etc).
I really like MindJuice's solution for Laser tower aiming.
Bigger playing fields would be nice, but I'd be concerned about losing the tightness that each level has.
Commas in high scores.
Thanks for the amazingly cool game, David. I've had a blastr so far, and I'm very much looking forward to playing more. :)
I would like to just have fun and kill the most creeps possible. Ash such, I think it would be nice to have a playing mode where there is no money,with endless waves of creeps.
some ideas: two possible final upgrades for each tower: e.g. A triple blaster tower Mk. 2 can be upgraded into either a sniper tower, or a quad blaster tower. This process should not be reversible. I love the idea of multiple paths/entries/exit idea, I also think that each level should have it's own pricing/money system (like I think is in GDS).
Althought I assume you designed each level to only play in one direction, I'm guessing that each level would play very differently if you could play it in reverse. Plus it would be an easy way to double the number of maps!!!
One feature that would be very cool would be the ability to playback the level once it is complete. Some of the levels get so fast-and-furious by the end that you don't have enough time to really watch the death and destruction. I'm not sure how feasible this feature is, but I would definitely use it!
Another feature that would be helpful is the ability to take a screenshot of the final screen (cleaned-up - no writing, etc on the screen), so that you can keep a copy of how you were able to complete the level (and possibly improve your strategy to maximize your score).
Thanks,
Woody
A couple cool ideas would be to have some extra unlockable turrets and enemies that become available after beating an entire difficulty leve (or the game, etc)l to increase replayability. Also cool would be maybe multiple upgrade paths for the turrrets? Maybe when they they are at level 6 (or whatever the 2nd to last upgrade level is) the player can choose from a couple of different varients for the final upgrade. Could be interesting!
I have thought about having multiple upgrade paths... choosing between two (or more) aspects to focus on so you can sorta pick the things that you think are most useful to spend money on. I'm limited mostly by the UI space I've reserved for it, and not wanting to use more. Have to think about that.
Also it would be VERY useful if you could have the ability to manually orient the direction of the laser turrets when locked....it can get frustrating trying to catch it aimed at the position you want so you can lock it only for it to start tracking another creep the completely opposite direction from where you're trying to point it. Also what could be cool is to be able to assign an arc of fire for the blaster turrets so you can focus them on a priority area if you need to
Well if you're going to have healing paths there should be a "decrease effectiveness tower." This tower will also decrease the effectiveness of the other paths, like a slow down path, so you have to be carefull where you put it.
The idea of different paths is cool. Something you could add on top of that would be switches for the paths. Kind of like a railroad switch. You can direct the creeps by shooting the switch but it takes a long time to activate because of the benifts of changing paths. Lets say you have a standard blaster tower set next to the switch. It will shoot the switch automatically like it was an enemy but if a creep passes by its focus will change to the creep until its out of sight/dead.
I'll post more if I come up with anything.
A broad range of ideas to pool from.
Ok - so this is the best iPhone game out there (at least as far as my 11 year old son and I are concerned) - what a great job on the graphics, the coding, the logic. just superb. the fine details and richness in the ui are awesome (sucking energy into the vortex towers; warping of the background; audio)
some ideas from my son and I (with some repetition what i've read below):
1.) "Cheat mode" - with the ability to have unlimited money (tap on the money it increments by $100). We sometimes wish we could have tons of level 7 towers just to see the destruction we can unleasy, but by the time we get enough money the level is over (or we've lost!). Probably cheat mode wouldn't let you track high scores. Maybe also choose the creep waves you want to come out.
2.) Commas in the scores!
3.) A type of tower that could move, maybe along a short path you define, to track creeps for certain range. Maybe like a Tank tower.
4.) Hybrid creeps - example, you hit it twice, and it breaks into 2 smaller creeps that move faster.
5.) Easier aiming of the laser towers.
6.) Moving of towers. One idea is you can move a tower but you lose a level (so i couldn't move level1's, level 2's would move but become level 1's etc...)
7.) Downloadable levels - and yes, I'd pay for more levels!
8.) Super easy mode - my 5 year old and 8 year old LOVE the game too, but even beginner levels are a bit too frustrating for them.
9.) More persistent final screen It's too easy to accidentally dismiss the final screen (winning OR losing) if you touch the screen. Maybe a Done button.
10.) Creeps that shoot back! This would mean towers could take damage and need healing somehow (maybe by connecting a vortex tower to it)
11.) Fire towers - shoot fire, what else?!
12.) Freezing towers - issue a spray of ice that slow creeps down permanently.
13.) Shielded creep - example, sheld pulses and can only be hit when shield is down; or only can be hit from a particular direction.
14.) This one is hard to explain. I'm constantly bouncing between the "Tower upgrade"screen (displayed when I tap ON a tower in the game interface), and the "Choose a tower to place," which I get when I tap on the screen but not on a creep. This means I have to constantly tap the main game screen to dismiss the "Tower upgrade" screen. Would be a very nice UI touch to have a small left arrow on the "Tower upgrade" screen so it could be quickly dismissed without having to tap on the game screen. Whew!
In general...some of these ideas will present a UI problem because there's not so much space at the bottom, but you could have that bottom area scrollable with a flick - maybe more advanced towers on one screen, the basic towers on the main screen (maybe use the arrow idea from #14?)
In any case, brilliantly done, can't wait for GD2 and for Swarm!
Tony (and Jonah)
I have a few ideas.
1. Plus+ intergration. Plus+ is one of the most popular social networks on the iPhone. Plus+ allows you to add achievements that will be worth points toward your own score. A lot of people just buy games with plus+ in it no matter what the game in order to get more points.
2. Mines. Maybe you can buy mines to put on the stage so when a creep runs over it the creep will be damaged when the mines explode.
3. Attacking and Defending? All tower defense games have you defending to area but what if you could attack? You could pick the amount of creeps you want to send (each would cost a little money) and for every one that gets into the end you will get money. The money could then be spent on upgrades for the creeps and different kinds of creeps. This would be an awesome idea!
I'd like to see a level editor so that I can make my own levels when i get tired of the existing ones. This would give the game new life for the "veterans" out there.
Others have touched on this already, but I think there is room for more variation in types of creeps. Right now, they vary only in speed and toughness. I see things like "Blackout" creeps and "Shielded" creeps have been suggested already, and I think those are good ideas. Here are a few more possibilities:
-Have creeps that are vulnerable/resistant to certain damage types.
-Stealth creeps, that can become invisible for a time, or even all the time. Maybe they be can be killed when invisible, but towers cannot see them, so they cannot be targeted, so only things like splash damage or lazer damage from a tower firing at a visible creep could kill it. Or maybe towers can see them, so the player can guess where they are by what his towers are doing. Maybe buying a beacon tower can reveal stealth creeps within a certain radius.
-Phase creeps. Would work similar to stealth creeps, but cannot be harmed at all while "phased out".
-Maybe a certain type of benevolent creep that the player would want to let though? That would be tough for the player to pull off!
I don't know if it's a good idea to have damageable or non-permanent (Mines? One-shot?) towers or not. But if Geodefense 2 went down that path (bad pun):
-Creeps that kill off a tower if they reach the end.
-Creeps that reflect damage back at the tower.
-Creeps that explode and take out nearby towers when shot.
I'll keep thinking about this, but honestly, this game is so good I would be still be happy if Geodefense 2 is just more levels!
One feature I would love is the ability to turndown/reduce the sparks generated by exploding creeps. I often find in the end game phases I am unable to select and upgrade equipment because it is completely hidden by the firestorm of "sparkies"
A really basic feature id like to see (even patched into gd 1) would be to be able to have a high score table for each level where you can enter your name -- my girlfriend and I are pretty competitive when it comes to these type game and it's always fun to beat eachotheres high scores and rub it in by dethroning the other persons name from the top (or see how close you were from doing so!)
(Ideally though if you were to implement something like this though, make it so that you only have to enter your name the first time before you start your session because it would get annoying to have to retype it every single time after every level)